The Biggest Loser

My president is Black but this post ain’t about that.

There will be plenty written about President Obama’s inauguration today and I’m not quite sure that I can add anything new to the conversation. That being said, WHAT THE FUCK IS WRONG WITH JOE BUDDEN AND SAIGON?!?

Now, I’m always down to see a good scrap, but this shit makes no sense because I’m a fan of ‘em both. When it comes to the bars few in the game can see Joey, if you can’t agree to that then you need serious help. On the other hand Sai-Gitty is a dope songwriter and I have never heard a song from dude that I didn’t like (I mean some are better than others, but dude has never really made a wack song. Too bad I can’t say the same for Papoose). My point is both of these cats are super-talented, and severely overlooked by the industry. About a year ago I got a chance to sit in Bassline with Sai and Just Blaze as they played The Greatest Story Never Told for me. The hairs stood up on the back of my neck— the album was THAT good. It felt special; it felt like an occasion, it felt like a modern day classic. Now mind you I’ve only heard the album once and there have been changes since then (Sai holla at me, trust me homie I understand, even if you think I don’t), but The Greatest Story… is exactly what Hip-hop needs right now. I was also privy to an early listening of Padded Room last fall. The tracks that Joey played that day were amazing (“Couldn’t Help It” is that shit!!!!), but like Sai, Joe has since made changes to his album, so I’m not sure what fans will actually hear upon its release.

So here we have two artists, both representing that old New York aesthetic (yes, Joe I know you’re Jersey, but NY is claiming you HA!), both deeply rooted in the art of MC’in and both stubborn as fuck. What started as a somewhat humorous, yet somewhat offensive line off of Joey’s “Mood Muzik III” (“I’m out to hit and run like Saigon“) is now a full-fledged rap beef. Now some skeptics claim it’s a publicity stunt for Joe’s upcoming Padded Room and Sai’s Warning Shots 2, but that’s bullshit because the truth is a beef between these two benefits no one. Neither release will fly off the shelf.

Saigon and Joe Budden have more in common then they may think, seeing as how both were failed by the major label system (Def Jam and Atlantic LOST!) and the older generation of New York rappers at the same time. I mean when was the last time Jay really put someone out? Doesn’t Diddy run a rap label? 50? It seems to me that Joey and Saigon would fare much better if they linked up, a collaboration is much more appealing than a beef these days. Shout to Slaughterhouse! Instead we have a war of words and when two titans clash, someone has to lose. No matter the outcome, one of these cats will end up with a blemish on their record and that’s just bad for Hip-hop. Damn we stay losing! – Rob the Music Ed

P.S. I do have an opinion on who is winning this battle, but that’s not the point of the post so I’ll keep my thoughts on that to myself.

  • Pierzy

    So, forgive me, but when did a good ol’ fashioned battle become bad for hip-hop? Was the Shan-KRS battle bad for hip-hop? If you don’t want a blemish on your record, step your game up (further) and win.

    I’m a big fan of both, but as long as it stays on wax, what’s the problem?

    • Rob The Music Ed

      There is nothing wrong with a good ‘ol fashioned battle. But for Saigon and Joe Budden the stakes are high right now. Both were failed by the major label system and have to work extra hard to get the attention of the hip-hop community.

      They each have dope albums waiting in the wings. I’d just like to see them both reach their full potential before they start going at each other.

      Taking a loss in a battle like this can seriously stunt one’s artistic growth.

      • Pierzy

        Rob -

        I understand your point and I don’t completely disagree with it, but without this battle would the projects be released any quicker? I doubt it. Also, it’s getting both of them on XXL’s website almost every day.

        But maybe you’re right…

        • $ykotic

          Pierzy stay on point!

          These dudes are killing worldstarhiphop with the hits.

          But again, battling is a part of hiphop. From Kool Moe Dee/Bizzy Bee to Jay/NaS, you had to be ready to battle or you weren’t considered a rapper!

          Remember that? So long as it doesn’t jumpoff in the streets, let the people choose.

          And I could care less who got dropped or didn’t sell. Most good artists don’t sell anyway!

          p.s. Budden mortally wounded Sai with that last one. Sai ure up!

      • LEO

        I think that if somehow Joey manages to lose this (not!!!) he’ll come out of it the same and keep it moving…he’s been through some beef with heavyweights and been good after- The Game, 50 Cent, Jay-Z(pump it up freestyle), Ransom? lol,

        Saigon on the other hand has the most to lose, I dont think he would be able to keep it “moving” after an L…it just seems to me like Joey has more going on and nothing to lose, Saigon could gain alot by winning..but he wont…he cant…

        • http://www.myspace.com/Lyrik07 L-Y, NawfWestSide

          Co-Sign.

    • Casey

      These disses are so personal. Jay-Z’s mom would NOT approve.

  • http://joebuddentv.com joe budden

    he started it, lol…

    i feel u tho

    • http://tonygrands.blogspot.com tony grand$

      ^^*Niggas completely glossed over the fact that this nigga above me is the Real Joey B! Lmmfao!!

      Anyhoo, I feel u Joe.

      “He started it…”

      That’s what’s up, sometimes a personal situation is bigger than anything else. U a personal dude, so I understand. It’s not about a record deal or promotion right now. Handle urs, cool breeze.

  • http://joebuddentv.com joe budden

    he started it, lol….

    i feel u tho

  • http://www.myspace.com/crockerishiphop Crocker

    I totally agree with Rob The Music Ed. on this one. Yeah, I appreciate the battle for what it is, but in the end, both are dope artists. This isn’t some one-sided laugh fest. (i.e. Charles Hamilton & Soulja Boy) I’m pretty sure both projects from both artists are gonna be lovely. They really do need to cut the ish out cause I do have a feeling this’ll lead to some senseless shit. Holla.

  • Matt Herbz

    Matt Herbz and the White Nigga Movement would like to wish you and your niggaz well on this historic day. We made it!

    *This message has been paid for by the White Nigga Movement and approved for reproduction by Matt Herbz.

  • LEO

    THE TRUEST ESSENCE OF RAP IS THE BATTLE, I LOVE IT!!! ITS JUST THE WRONG NIGGAS AGAINST EACHOTHER…BUT STILL…

    “P.S. I do have an opinion on who is winning this battle, but that’s not the point of the post so I’ll keep my thoughts on that to myself.”

    LOL EVERYONE KNOWS JOEY’S WINNING…DONT HOLD BACK…BUT I DO AGREE THEY SHOULDN’T BE BEEFING…THEY SHOULD TAG TEAM ON WAYNE…UM…PAUSE?

    • http://www.myspace.com/Lyrik07 L-Y, NawfWestSide

      LoL.

  • http://www.myspace.com/someloveandsomehate Slash

    I think I can agree with most of what you said except for the statement that Saigon has not made any wack music before. I tried to force myself to enjoy “Gotta Believe It” but the magnetic pull of the fast forward button was too strong to ignore.

    But he is very dope when he’s not saying or doing something idiotic outside of the studio.

    That said, he’s also getting mollywhopped by Mr. Budden.

    • Rob The Music Ed

      Nah homie don’t get it fucked up “Believe It” was DOOOPE. I can see beefin’ with the hook, but then again i have no problem with Auto-tune.
      Peep this part in the 2nd verse:

      “I tried to help the label see the vision/But they lowered me to a sub-division, you gotta be fuckin’ kiddin’/They rather me pretend to be something I’m not/I’m the new Public Enemy, I’m different than Yung Joc/And, nah, I ain’t dissin’, this nigga’s up in the Forbes/Shit, I ain’t made a dollar tryna rap for the cause/But in these next four bars, I’ll tell you about my level of laws/They enforcin’ on North American shores/Dawg, if they can have rifles on their farms/Then I don’t see why they knocked T.I. for tryna bare arms.”

      How can u front on that homie!?!

  • http://hiphoponmymind.blogspot.com DJ Daddy Mack

    I AGREE WITH ROB.

  • tommy gunz

    “what are you tryin to be..superspade or somethin?”….walt kowalski-gran torino…

  • Beans

    I kinda agree with u
    but i enjoy diss track especially joey ahah
    u cant lie to urself,
    Pain in his life is so dope to not like it
    thats it

    i dont care about beef buzz, all i know is pain in his life is a great diss track
    and if greatest story never told and padded room are great, its all good

  • amar

    i disagree…it won’t do anything negative or positive for record sales, but in the long-term, will add to their legacy and will give them more attention. In the long term i think it’ll help them stay relevent longer, which means make money longer.

    it’s also refreshing to see two rappers beefing who actually don’t suck…or are both at one another’s level. Tired of all this ice t vs. soulja boy or jim jones/50 cent/soulja boy vs. everyone bullshit.

  • that guy

    co-sign. i never heard a wack saigon record.

  • Oneofthemyo’s

    Yeah with budden personalitiy that nigga dont give a fuck what people think of him win or lose but thats just it that nigga is NOT gonna lose. So sai might have a blemish on his record so what…so does jigga…if they both got albums I wanna hear it because aside from some unforseen brilliant marketting scheme none of them aint clearing a 100,000 sold, and I say that knowing I WOULD buy both there shits. Good hip hop is just not selling right now either way!

    • BIGNAT

      you said the best point joey ain’t back in the game because he fell down. he back in the game because he got up. when you already been to the bottom there is no fear and thats why he can go in. saigon still has not hit bottom like joe has. keep fucking around with budden’s he going see himself on the xxl milk carton hahahahah.

  • sealsaa

    I couldn’t disagree more. A clash of two lyrical titans is EXACTLY what hip hop needs. Both of these guys are so talented, and damn near equal lyrically that an L isn’t going to be that big a deal. Either way, its not like the loser is going to lose to a lesser MC. I think a battle will bring out the best in these two, and the best part is that its being broadcast on XXL and various other hip hop websites, and lets face it, they could both use the exposure. I’m with Pierzy, as long as it stays on wax, I don’t see an issue.

    • http://bones_42@hotmail.com Doobie42

      I don’t think so my dude. When the clash is damn near equal, that is when someone has the most to lose. I don’t know about yall but when Nas ethered jay… jay was never quite the same to me ever again. plus i don’t think this will stay on wax. outside the lyrics sai is too hard and budden is too much of a bitch.

      • Oneofthemyo’s

        I too think saigon a real nigga but the fact of the matter is I aint never met that nigga..so if you’ve never met any of them(unless u have) how u gonna call budden a bitch? Just saying… People think he took an L by backing out of that ransom shit but how many people actually thought budden would’ve went to ransom’s house in the first place, plus if something do happen to ransom when shit dies down is budden still a bitch???? Unless u aint basing your argument of him being a bitch on ransom of course and u just on some other shit…

  • Curtis75Black

    1st off, We all know Saigon is a Honda gettin’ waxed right now, so don’t even front !! 2ndly, This Battle will hopefully not only bring out the best in competition within the 2 but give these lyricist the exposure they need. We listen to Hip Hop everyday but it’s just a new song here, a new song there. If the song is Hot, that’s good but other than that nothing to really capture the attention of todays fans. It’s the norm. This shit has peeps attention on every Hip Hop site and everyone has a opinion (Biased or Not) that will keep the convo going. Of course, there’s gonna be a loser but whoever it is is just a matter of opinion. Keep it on wax and everything will be fine.

  • Beaaans

    Rob,

    I kinda agree with that blog
    but why not just enjoy budden diss tracks, pain in his life is the shitn everybody know that
    so its cool

    if greatest story never told and padded room are great too, thats all good

    but i dont see the point of hating on beef when it make us hear some dope lines by joe tahah

    and why dont give us a quick preview of padded room?

    • Rob The Music Ed

      Oh man you gotta read Last Year’s “Hollywood issue” with Luda on the cover for the low down on Padded Room.

      I personally recommend “I Couldn’t Help It”

  • louie mo

    nigga you sound like a bitch cause your boyfriends are fightin…….. nigga grow some nuts….. hip hop started with this shit ……..Battlin…….. believe it or not there was a time this how niggaz earn their stripes and this was not use a promotional tool……….. damn when you start listining to rap …….. in 03???????????? step up your hiphop knowledge ………

  • willingboro

    sai is getting demolished by jump off. NO COMPETITION. anyone with 2 ears knows that.

  • te noh

    This post is way off base.

    Rob wrote, “Now, I’m always down to see a good scrap, but this shit makes no sense because I’m a fan of ‘em both.”

    Just because you are a fan a both does not mean that this is not a good scrap. I like Jay and Nas, and “Ether” was still awesome as all get out. It’s nice to hear a battle on wax that didn’t start off one-sided, although it quickly became that way.

    Rob wrote, “Now some skeptics claim it’s a publicity stunt for Joe’s upcoming Padded Room and Sai’s Warning Shots 2, but that’s bullshit because the truth is a beef between these two benefits no one. Neither release will fly off the shelf.”

    You’ve written a blog about it, right? So did BXS. Both Budden and Sai are getting their press, although Budden’s is probably better. Rappers are only supposed to battle when it financially benefits them?

    “So here we have two artists, both representing that old New York aesthetic (yes, Joe I know you’re Jersey, but NY is claiming you HA!), both deeply rooted in the art of MC’in and both stubborn as fuck.”

    The old NY aesthetic is the battle! The art of the emcee is moving the crowd and exposing sucka mc’s. Again, not sure what the problem is.

    “They each have dope albums waiting in the wings. I’d just like to see them both reach their full potential before they start going at each other. Taking a loss in a battle like this can seriously stunt one’s artistic growth.”

    So, its okay for them to battle as long as they reached their full potential? Or after they release their new albums? What is your point?

    • http://www.myspace.com/Lyrik07 L-Y, NawfWestSide

      Hmm.. the homie Te has some good pointz buddy.

  • DBlock

    “somebody better play third wheel try to stop the fukk…”

    lol. joey’s bodybaggin’ this cat. JERSEY!

  • dan99

    joey put this saigon in his grave, but I somewhat agreed to this post, but damn that beef was entertaining. One of the best diss since ether, so it was worth it, I say.

  • Pana

    I agree with someone above who said at least they were on the same level. That’s when it gets interesting. Otherwise, this would’nt even make it into any SERIOUS discussions or the hip hop history books.

  • http://www.myspace.com/Lyrik07 L-Y, NawfWestSide

    Damn, so i guess itz unanimous, Sai iz gettin’ bodied somethin’ crucial ryte now. I agree with alot of theze commentz, and i like both Budden’s (preferably, i can’t front) and Sai’z muzik also, but Sai should’ve stayed away from this one, stik to makin’ songz buddy, battlin’ ain’t ur thing. And 4 the record, flashin’ money, carz, and ur apt. iz not a good promotional tooL 4 an artist of ur caliber, regardless of ur intentionz Sai. U fukked up with that one, jes’ like u fucced up pikkin’ a lyrikal battLe with the same kat who bodied Jay-Z and on that pump it up joint. Itz a wrap Sai-gitty, but i’LL prolly still cop ur album if u ever drop that bitch, one-hunned – DoDo

  • BGZ

    Fuck all this bickerin’ beef!
    I know the music industry is fucked up, but these dudes have the potential to be the new Nas (artistic, introspective yet cocky) and Jay (having strong street-cred, analytical, produced by Just Blaze) if they step they game up and they blow it!
    Obama is in office now there hasn’t been a better time to challenge the social problems – that’s what rappers have been to addressing from The Message to NWA, because they couldn’t DO anything.
    And for Saigon, dude is out in the cold right now; he could be as big as he wanna be, but saying one more word could have the rest of Slaughterhouse on his back (nh) and he’s no match to them on wax.
    Who’s gonna help you out, Tru Life? (cue laugh track)

    • BGZ

      … or I might have been wrong.

  • re-yo

    Am I the only one who doesn’t think Joey isn’t winning? Sai’s last dis was ruthless!

  • http://www.myspace.com/Lyrik07 L-Y, NawfWestSide

    Yea, proLLy sun. Even Sai know he takin’ a L on this one. Joey could come avg. with the next one and stiLL be declared the victor.